Hayden was given a breathalyzer test before he could get into the dance

[Mary Rogers]

last night for the homecoming celebration

I really think they should inform the parents before they administer this test. He had no choice, blow or you don't get in....needless to say as a freshmen this year it was his first high school dance, but I have a real problem with this policy. They are assumed to be guilty until they prove otherwise...

any thoughts?

[Starlite9711]

Ooh what a tough thing Mary! Im not sure how I feel about it?! Good that they are cracking down (because lord knows some of them ARE guilty) but for the innocent ones, it's not real fair. Did they make it known BEFORE hand that this was the policy? I think that might be a bit better, if everyone (parents and students) knew before hand. That way kids know better and parents have time to talk to their kids about it,a s well as getting used to the idea themselves. If it was a "surprise" just to get kids in trouble, and the parents had no clue, that makes me uncomfortable.
Just my thoughts on the subject

[KerryMac]

Oh, Mary. I'd be furious, too. I hate the evolution of policing policies in public schools. I know there are problems, but so many things wind up punishing the good kids.
For heaven sake, a parent can't even give their high school daughter a midol to take to school anymore! Yeesh.
Are you going to speak up?

[Mary Rogers]

I am going to speek with the administrator about it on Monday...had I known in advance (I didn't) I could have spoke with Hayden about it....he had no idea either

and I agree Kerry about the midol - I think we need to "trust" our kids more. I realize that there are always those who don't follow the rules or might show up drunk before the dance, but when the good kids are presumed guilty, that is where I have the problem.

we need less intrusion in our lives, not more

[suzanne]

I think it is great when the schools are stepping up and saying that certain things will not be tolerated. My ds is a junior this year & it would not bother me in the least if his school did this. There are too many that think they can get away with whatever because mom & dad are not there. This is just my opinion though.

[Julie DeGuia]

I'm not sure how I feel about it... if they are giving it to everyone and not singling anyone out then at least it is "fair" and I'm sure the intentions are good. However, maybe a warning to the parents would have been nice!

[AllynD]

I am going to go out on a limb and say that I think it is a great policy, Mary. I know your son was innocent, but kids at high school dances around the country have ended up at local emergency rooms with alcohol poisoning.

This is a very serious problem nationwide-- kids carrying Poland Springs water bottles full of gin or vodka have wreaked havoc at high school dances, vomiting on the dance floor, and ruining the evening for everyone. Unfortunately, sometimes these kids drank at home before the dance with the knowledge of certain parents.

If the kids know there is a no alcohol policy and that it will be enforced, all the kids are safer.

[Jen D]

I have to agree if they were being fair and doing it to everyone... then I think it is a great way to keep kiddos safe. But,if they were singling out certain kids I think that is absolutely not right and I would be in the office on Monday.

[Scrapbird]

I agree with you, Mary, that you and Hayden should have known.
But I think I'd personally feel safer about my kids going to a dance where I KNEW there was no one who was using alcohol.

[esther_a]

I wonder was there an incident that prompted this reaction? I teach at a senior school, and we've never had to resort to anything like this. For Hayden, though, I don't think you should take it as a "guilty until proven innocent" intrusion, but just a precaution and be glad that it means the dance will be safer and more pleasant for everyone. I can imagine it could feel very threatening for the kids. I hope the testers had happy, reassuring faces and sent the kids on their way with an "enjoy your evening".
Sadly it seems to be the way things are going. Sports people have to endure more and more rigorous testing.

[snard]

I think it's an invasion of privacy just like pee tests.
If someone is showing no signs of having anything to drink..Why have them do a breath test?
Police don't breath test everyone, why should schools be different.

[Joey_M]

Mary, can they legally test your child without your consent?
It's too bad the school didn't advertise that they were going to test. It's better to proactive than reactive, right? Isn't the point to get the kids to not drink? Letting the kids know ahead of time would encourage kids to not drink while busting them at the door does nothing but suspend or expel kids. It makes me sad that the school feel like they need to do the parent's job too...*sigh*

Let us know what you do!

[deanie]

I think that parents and students should have been informed. It is unfortunately the fact that everywhere we go security precautions have to be tolerated by the innocent to protect us from the few offenders. I'm so sorry it has to start in high school.

[Carol Elliott]

My son is also a freshman (youngest of three) and went to homecoming. While they did not give a breathalyzer tests to get into the homecoming dance they have done random ones at prom in the past (you have to be a junior/senior to go). The kids all know they won't be allowed to get in to any dance if they've been drinking. I'd much rather they give them to all the kids, than randomly so some who drink are missed, while others who drank are caught and not allowed in.

I think there are bigger fights to fight, say incompetent teachers.

[anke]

I am kind of torn about it. As a parent of an innocent child I would feel protected by the policy. It's just a shame that we have to resort to things like that, but I am all for keeping our children safe.

[mugsbigsis]

Our schools have a city wide "random drug test." At the beginning of the school year you can sign the form saying that your kid's name goes into a pool where they might randomly be drawn and informed (by letter to the parent at home) to come downtown to the hospital for a random drug test. I'm all for this. Every year I sign the paper right under my kid's signature. I think it gives them one more reason to "say no" to drugs.

Unfortunately, we have had some incidents that could have been prevented had our high schoolers been required to take a breathalyzer test before entering an activity. I'm afraid I'm all for it. (I wouldn't think it would be a bad idea after the dance either) I like that someone else is looking out for my kid when I'm trying to let him "spread his wings". I think it's all in how you look at it and I see it as the school "watching out for the good kids" rather than saying they're "guilty".

[MIDA78466]

I'm with Kelly on this one. I think the school is really looking out for the kids. I think it is a a great idea and too bad they couldn't search purses and pockets for drugs before entering either.

[ValerieP]

Wow-I will have to talk to our admin about this and see if it has-or even could have happened in our district. I do know that young people die here on a regular basis because of drug and alcohol use-and I also know that I close my eyes to the horrific things that the kids do in the school I teach. I think your son and you should have known about the test. But I think the idea of the test is a good one- to protect the innocent.

[KerryMac]

Well, I guess I'm in the minority here. I usually am, though
I just think that kids who are determined to drink, use drugs, etc., will do so no matter what. They'll just go elsewhere.
I suppose I've been very fortunate with my daughters. But I really feel like the main thing that kept them safe was us. We tried very hard to keep the lines of communication open and talked about tough subjects all the time. All around us, kids were using everything imaginable and we talked about that, too.
I know that a breathalyzer test at a school dance would not have kept our poor next door neighbor safe. He always knew where to go to get and use his drugs and alcohol.
And sometimes I feel like all of these restrictrions that we are imposing on kids is contributing to the binge drinking that is rampant in college. We keep such tight reigns on them up until then and then they get away from home and rules and go nuts.
Just my two cents...

and ps...I think they should go after any parent who serves alcohol to underage kids. That seems to be so common now. It's horrible and irresponsible!

[Shannamay]

My guess is that the school was out to protect the innocent, rather than stop a student who already knew where to get supplied with alcohol/drugs.
Kerry, I think you're absolutely right about the impact and power of strong, aware and communicative families, but even that does not work in every case. My daughter has always had a very strong moral compass and has on the whole been able to stand up to peer pressure with flair and style. She even waited on one occasion in the foyer of a cinema while her friends watched a movie she thought wasn't appropriate. One of my sons, while many of his life values differ somewhat to mine, has never indulged to the point of excess. However my other son, always a more sensitive and needy boy, despite the care and attention he recieved from family was completely unable to resist pressure from the people around him. He so desperately wanted to fit in with the "cool" kids, and would do anything they labeled as "cool". His has been a long and difficult road, eventually spending time in prison because of crimes he committed while under the influence of alcohol and drugs. While he was underage, and recognising that he was a child at risk, we limited his activities to those around school, sport and church. We talked often and openly about the tough things in life, and loved and supported him in every way possible. I would have been exceedingly grateful to any school or sporting community that had the gumption to ensure that what we were trying to do was being supported by them. I sincerely wish that those who had and shared drugs and alcohol with my son at those school and sporting functions had been "eliminated" by breathalizer tests to make those few places as safe as we perhaps naively assumed them to be.
I do think though Mary, that if this was in fact the school's motive then both parents and students should have been previously informed.

[Applechick]

Mary I agree that the school should have informed parents in advance of their new policy.
I doubt that the school presume everyone to be guilty - think about what would happen if they only chose to test a few and your son had been one of them! That would have been much more insulting.

I've been through the teenage years, and much as we all want to think our children are the innocent ones and would never do such things, the reality is that these years are all about pushing the boundaries a bit and learning life's lessons, that's what growing up is all about! I'm going to be controversial here and say that we can NEVER presume that our kids are innocent of any wrong doing, while the 'others' are the bad ones KWIM? I'm NOT saying that your kids are lying to you about drinking etc. - but I'm asking you to think about growing up - did you admit to your parents everything you did?
I think as parents that we need our kids to know that everyone makes mistakes, but that's the scary bit about parenting; they need to make their own mistakes - and they will, regardless of how much we tell them - and we need to be there to still love and support them.
Living in Scotland there is a very real culture of underage drinking, and I totally agreed with my daughter's school in refusing entry to any function of anyone they suspected of drinking - and if they had brought in breathalising for everyone I would have agreed wholeheartedly that this be implemented.

I have seen talented students from 'good' homes had their lives ruined because of developing psychosis because of 'recreational' drug use. I think that is such an odd phrase, and should really be banned! I talked last week with the mother of one student who is distraught that her handsome boy is fighting mental illness now. He is in his late twenties, already has a first class honours degree from university and is doing vocational training with us. He is a star student in every way - but his parents didn't know he had been using hash to relax at weekends for some time as he had his own flat! - and really, why should they have known. He is a man, he made that choice. Now he is back at home, and they are doing their best to help him stay strong. They are good, wonderful parents and he is a wonderful young man who has made a wrong choice in life. Do you think that if his parents had asked him over Sunday dinner " are you doing drugs son?" he would have said "yes mum and dad, I am...get over it" No one wants to disappoint their parents so that is why kids lie. All I'm saying is that if we put our kids on a pedestal then they are lonely up there...terrified of falling off and crashing through the high expectations we have of them! I agree with Kerry, If we give them all the information we can about the consequences of different choices in life; drinking alcohol, taking drugs, smoking, sex then that's all we can do... and support the schools and colleges in what they are doing to try and keep kids safe!

Sorry, if this has turned into an essay, but I tell the students I have to deal with every day that it's not that they are BAD people; it's their behaviour that needs to change...I truly hate that Good kid, Bad kid thing...

Fiona

[oldvwblues]

It's really sad that times have changed so much that a Breathalyzer is necessary but they have. All it takes a one bad apple to ruin anything and if this helps weed out that one bad one, then it's not hurting to check everyone..does make it fair. So many schools now have to have metal detectors at the doors and limited entrances and who knows what..back in the old days, they might have a random locker check and yes, from time to time they did find something "illegal". The world has really changed so much since the times when I grew up (60's)...we never worried about locking the car or the doors, could go to sleep with the windows raised...the world was a much kinder safer place..wish we could turn it back into what it was. I always wished my own children could have experienced those days..and shudder to think what's waiting ahead for my grandchildren if something doesn't change. So very sad. Now I am depressed.

[KerryMac]

You know, this is an interesting thread and everyone here has great points.
There are no easy answers to modern challenges. Kids are exposed to so many negative influences that I would have never imagined when I was their age.
I'm not convinced that breathalyzer and urine tests given to all will either a) keep kids safe or b)prevent kids from using. I would lean more toward administering the tests to kids who appear to be intoxicated. I can't get past the invasion of privacy thing.

I think there are many reasons why kids make the decisions they do. They are very complex little creatures.

I do know that several things kept me from drinking as a youth: in the 7th grade at a school dance (I know, I know...) a girl whom I did not know became very drunk outside the school building and got sick all over my friends and me. Someone told us who she was and where she lived so we cleaned her up and literally carried her home. I was so upset by the whole thing that I vowed not to drink and I didn't (honestly) until college.
My parents never said "don't drink" but instead did not shield me from adult friends and relatives who had drinking issues and did not candy coat anything. They always said "no matter what time of night or what state you're in or who you're with, you can always phone us and we'll come get you no questions asked. Just call, we want you safe." I think that gave me a sense of trust and a feeling that I didn't need to hide anything and could come to them if I made a mistake or was in an unsafe situation.
I also never saw my parents drink more than one beer or glass of wine ( except for a rather humorous incident involving my mom and 2 Singapore Slings and our next door neighbor).
My DH and I have taken the same approach with the girls. I know they've imbibed. A bit in high school, more so in college. They've never hidden it from us. And thankfully, they've never gotten in a car with a drunk driver nor have they driven under the influence. We've gotten that phone call a few times, and know that they and their friends are very strict about assigning a designated driver.
Our girls are not perfect by any means, but they have managed to avoid certain adolescent issues and for that I am very thankful.
Sorry about the length of this! Maybe I just talked my kids to death like I did you guys

[Julie DeGuia]

OK... Fiona and Kerry have given me a lot to think about. And my kids are only 5 and 7!!! I was already scared of raising teenagers, but now I'm terrified! LOL!

[Mary Rogers]

thanks for all the valuable input on this subject. I really think I might have approached the entire subject differently had I known in advance. It is not that I am completely against the policy, but just that I didn't get to make a choice for my own child.

We have a great open relationship with Hayden and I know that he realizes the impact of drinking and drugs on his future plans in sports and college. We aren't blind and know that he will be tempted, we just hope we have given him enough support to make the right decisions.

[oldvwblues]

There comes that time you just have to have faith in them and know they will have the good sense to make the right decisions..like Kerry said, the communication is the greatest key...and never forget what it was like to be their age and understand. Was getting a little freaky about something my oldest was doing and having a conversation with my oldest best friend (since we were in 4th grade...a life time ago!) and she reminded me about us when we were that age...never forgot that advice..and there were plenty of times I had to stop and think and remember...and understand. Still wish things hadn't changed so much though. Don't dread teenagers...they are actually pretty cool...I survived four of them (LOL)..maybe I should say they survived me...my oldest broke me in (whew) and the rest were a breeze pretty much. They all grew up and have become good productive people who all help others and I couldn't be prouder of them. My oldest took a little longer getting there, he did have some things happen that made things difficult like a friend who committed suicide and he found him, but he did make it...and there is still nothing we all can't talk about. Back to Mary's original post, it would have been nice if the school system would have notified the parents in advance about any policies like this so it wouldn't have been such a shock. I think they have the best interest of the good kids really...and the others may need help.

[KerryMac]

Don't be afraid, Julie! Like Vicki said, teens are pretty cool.
This thread just touched a nerve with me, I think. I see schools cutting back more and more on art, music, recess and even on giving hugs!
I hate to see us rely on impersonal approaches to problems. I think what we need is more of this
YouTube - PS22 Chorus "CIRCLE GAME" Joni Mitchell
and less of "zero tolerance"
xoxoxo, Kerry

[FlowerGirl]

Although I can see why it would be upsetting, I have to agree with some who feel it's alright if they do it to everyone -- no singling out. There is no harm in it and if the kids are alcohol free, then they have nothing to fear.

When we lived in Australia they did random breath tests on the roads. They block off the entire road or highway and EVERY car pulls up to a stall and does a test and shows proof of license, etc. If you try to turn around when you see the block, they have cars that go after you. It was inconvenient, just something you had to do.

I hope his dance was fun after that

[blkcow]

Our schools (years ago) in the 90's, brought in drug sniffing dogs to smell the kids lockers. We had no knowledge of it beforehand. The dogs's "alerted" on my sons locker (he was a junior or senior). He was hauled into the Principals office and questioned at length. Well, long story short the dog had alerted on "gunhsot residue"...not drugs. They questioned him at length and the upshot of the matter was....he worked at a feedlot and the day before an animal had been severly wounded and had to be put down. Mark wore the same coat that he had been wearing the day of the shooting incident. They apologized for the incident (which I didn't think they needed to do) and let Mark on his way. But, what if Mark had brought a gun to school...we all know what could have happened. We were not mad at all. I do think it was in the best interest of all the kids.....plus they "weeded" (poor choice of words LOL) out the drug users and dealers, right then and there!!

[maureenreynolds]

If my children were in school now I would be glad for the policy. I have grandchildren in hs now and hope they will do so at dances for them. My/your child may be innocent but what about the one who isn't?? In no way do I want my child/granchild to be harmed by a child, and yes children kill/rape/harm other children, because no one checked if they were fit to be present.

Our children/my grandchildren do not live in the world we grew up in and they face pressures we never knew. 20+ yrs ago I worked in a school age day care setting in an middle class affluent area. Parents were clueless about how knowledgeable and 'sophisticated' their children were, and I'm talking about 1st graders. Safe is much better than sorry imho.